Grusch, Greys, and Reptilians: Is Someone Trying to Sell Us an Alien War?
Jamie Leonard
An Alien War? Wait, What?
In September 2026, former U.S. intelligence officer and UFO whistleblower David Grusch appeared on The Joe Rogan Experience and dropped what should have been a bombshell. According to Grusch, U.S. intelligence channels have collected information suggesting that non-human intelligences have been engaged in some form of conflict with one another. He described an alleged crashed spacecraft associated with Reptilian beings, with both living Reptilians and dead Greys reportedly discovered at the scene. Later in the interview, Grusch stated that American military personnel had shot and killed the surviving Reptilians because they posed a threat. Let that sink in for a moment. If his account is accurate, American personnel have allegedly encountered living extraterrestrials, recovered bodies belonging to another species, and found themselves involved in a deadly confrontation. That's an extraordinary amount of information to absorb, even for those of us who have been following UFO reports for years.
For readers unfamiliar with UFO lore, the Greys and Reptilians are two frequently described types of alleged extraterrestrial beings. Greys are often portrayed as small, thin humanoids with oversized heads, large black eyes, and grey skin, although accounts also describe much taller versions. They became particularly prominent in modern abduction stories and are often associated with genetic experimentation. Reptilians, sometimes called Reptoids or Draconians, are generally described as taller, muscular, humanoid beings with reptile-like features, including scales and elongated faces. Depending on the source, they have been portrayed as everything from benevolent extraterrestrials to hostile beings seeking control over humanity. These descriptions come from UFO testimony, folklore, and popular culture; neither species has been scientifically established to exist. Nevertheless, both have occupied prominent places in UFO research for decades, which makes Grusch's apparent confirmation of their existence particularly noteworthy.
But what caught my attention wasn't just the crashed spacecraft or the deceased Greys. It was how quickly the conversation turned to the possibility of an extraterrestrial war. At approximately 1 hour and 18 minutes into the interview, the subject of non-human intelligence fighting other non-human intelligence comes up, and Grusch confirms that such activity has reportedly been documented through intelligence collection. Then comes a particularly important qualification. Grusch describes it as "what we perceive as warfare." He acknowledges that the apparent conflict could be something else entirely. Rogan then suggests that the Greys and Reptilians were fighting each other, and Grusch tentatively agrees.
That initial exchange lasts roughly 39 seconds, from 1:18:48 to 1:19:27. There are additional questions about the incident shortly afterward, and Rogan returns to the surviving Reptilians nearly 50 minutes later, around 2:07. But nowhere in these discussions do we receive a date, location, explanation of who initiated the alleged conflict, or any understanding of the relationship between the beings involved. Grusch is careful about revealing certain details, citing the need to protect people who provided sensitive information. That's understandable, but it leaves an enormous amount of room for interpretation. More importantly, he does not provide public evidence that would allow anyone outside those channels to independently verify the event.
We're left with a spectacular claim, very little context, and an interpretation that could have extraordinary consequences if accepted as fact. So, are Greys and Reptilians really at war? Maybe. But before we start preparing for an interstellar invasion, I think we should consider something.
The Hunter and the Deer
Imagine an alien observing Earth. It witnesses a human hunter shoot and kill a deer. The incident is documented and reported up the chain of command. By the time the intelligence reaches military leadership, the conclusion is alarming: Humans and deer are at war.
Obviously, that isn't the case.
The alien observed a real event. Its report may have been completely accurate. But without understanding the relationship between humans and deer, it drew an entirely incorrect conclusion. An isolated snapshot does not tell the whole story.
Now consider Grusch's account of a crashed spacecraft containing living Reptilians and deceased Greys. Even if the incident occurred exactly as described, does it establish that two extraterrestrial civilizations are at war? Or are we interpreting an unfamiliar situation through the only framework we know? An accurate observation can still produce a wildly inaccurate conclusion.
This is especially important when the information is being interpreted through military intelligence channels. Military organizations are trained to recognize threats, assess capabilities, identify adversaries, and develop defensive responses. That's their job, and we certainly want them doing it. But when the subject involves civilizations whose biology, technology, culture, and motivations are completely unknown to us, how reliable are the assumptions we're making? It's easy to look at dead bodies and a crashed spacecraft and conclude that somebody was fighting somebody. Understanding what actually happened is a different matter entirely.
Beyond the Military Reports
To better understand Grusch's claims, we're going to have to venture a little outside most people's comfort zones.
The individuals we're about to examine don't necessarily come from the intelligence community. Their information comes through hypnosis, remote viewing, channeling, and other unconventional methods. I'm not suggesting these practices are scientifically validated, or that the people using them are 100% accurate. I have my own beliefs about their work, and readers are certainly entitled to theirs. But here's what catches my attention: some of these individuals were describing Greys, Reptilians, and complicated relationships between extraterrestrial civilizations years, sometimes decades, before Grusch discussed them publicly in 2026.
Does that mean they were right? Not necessarily. These ideas have circulated within UFO communities for a long time, and similarities between accounts don't automatically make them independent corroboration. But I think the timing, the similarities, and particularly the differences deserve a closer look. Coincidence? Maybe. Maybe not.
Dolores Cannon: Are the Greys Even What We Think They Are?
Long before David Grusch became a familiar name in UFO circles, Dolores Cannon was collecting some of the most unusual accounts of extraterrestrial encounters ever published. Cannon, who passed away in 2014, spent decades working with hypnosis and eventually developed her own method known as Quantum Healing Hypnosis Technique, or QHHT. Through sessions with thousands of clients, she documented stories involving past lives, alleged extraterrestrial contact, genetic experimentation, and civilizations that supposedly existed long before recorded human history. Her books, particularly The Custodians and The Convoluted Universe series, present an extraordinarily detailed picture of humanity's place within a much larger extraterrestrial community.
Now, hypnosis is not a scientifically reliable method of recovering hidden historical memories. Suggestion, expectation, and reconstructed memories can all influence what subjects report. But I find it interesting that subjects in Cannon's work repeatedly described certain beings and relationships that also appear in other UFO narratives. One recurring theme was that some of the little Grey beings weren't necessarily independent biological individuals in the way we understand ourselves. They were sometimes described as manufactured workers, biological robots, or entities designed to carry out particular tasks for more advanced intelligences. Cannon's overall picture wasn't simply one of hostile aliens versus friendly aliens, but a complicated collection of civilizations, responsibilities, and activities that humanity might not fully understand.
Now think about Grusch's crashed spacecraft. If some Greys are manufactured workers, as Cannon's subjects claimed, their presence aboard a Reptilian craft could mean something very different from what we're imagining. Finding a dead Grey might be more comparable to discovering a disabled machine or a deceased employee than finding an enemy soldier. I'm not suggesting Cannon solved the mystery decades before Grusch raised it, but her work introduces a possibility that doesn't fit neatly into the story of two opposing alien armies.
And things get even more complicated when we consider the next researcher.
Elizabeth April: What If the Conflict Isn't Between Species?
Elizabeth April is a Canadian remote viewer, author, and spiritual speaker who has spent years describing what she believes are extraterrestrial civilizations and their involvement with Earth. Unlike Cannon, who primarily worked through hypnotized subjects, April claims to obtain information through her own remote-viewing and channeling experiences. She describes a childhood involving unusual perceptions, her introduction to past-life regression as a teenager, and an alleged extraterrestrial abduction at age eighteen that dramatically changed her understanding of the world. Her work eventually expanded into detailed descriptions of extraterrestrial groups, hidden human history, and an organization she calls the Galactic Federation of Light.
April's claims are not independently established facts, and remote viewing has not been demonstrated to provide consistently reliable information about extraterrestrial civilizations. But what makes April particularly interesting for this article is that we can examine what she was saying before Grusch's recent interview. On May 30, 2024, April appeared on episode #779 of Tin Foil Hat with Sam Tripoli, titled The Downfall of Reptilians. During the conversation, she described an alleged history in which Reptilian beings inhabited Earth long before modern humans. According to her account, the Anunnaki subsequently arrived seeking gold, became involved in human genetic development, and were eventually joined by other extraterrestrial groups with their own interests and agendas.
April describes the Galactic Federation as an organization made up of many different extraterrestrial species united by common principles rather than biology. According to her, the Federation attempts to enforce universal laws, including what she calls the law of non-intervention, which limits how more advanced civilizations may interfere with less advanced ones. She also describes an opposing collection of groups interested in power, control, and resources. Within this framework, conflicts aren't necessarily divided along species lines. The issue is which interests and principles an individual or civilization supports.
This is particularly relevant because April claims the Federation was regularly discussing alleged Reptilian activities and possible responses. She presents an extraterrestrial political landscape involving councils, competing agendas, and ongoing disagreements over how Earth should be treated. April also says that when she first encountered the Federation through astral projection, she appeared in the form of a seven-foot-tall Grey being, which she interprets as connected to her own extraterrestrial identity. None of this establishes that Greys and Reptilians are friends, enemies, or anything else. But it does introduce an interesting possibility: what if different factions within these alleged civilizations have different alliances? What if some Greys cooperate with Reptilians while others oppose them? What if the incident Grusch described was part of a political dispute rather than a species-wide war?
Bashar: What If the Greys and Reptilians Are Actually Related?
Of all the accounts we're examining, Bashar may offer the most unexpected interpretation of the relationship between Greys and Reptilians. Bashar is the name given to an alleged extraterrestrial intelligence channeled by Darryl Anka, who has been presenting these communications publicly since the 1980s. Anka describes Bashar as a member of a civilization known as the Essassani and has accumulated decades of recorded material covering consciousness, human evolution, extraterrestrial life, genetics, and possible future events. Anka doesn't claim to be presenting recovered government documents or accounts from physical witnesses. He attributes the information to communication with a separate non-human intelligence, a claim that remains independently unverified.
What makes Bashar relevant here is the dated record of those communications. In material attributed to an April 18, 1997 session called Being Your Natural Self, Bashar describes Reptilians not as an entirely unrelated species, but as genetically engineered offshoots of the Greys. The account describes connections between the groups through genetics and a larger collective consciousness. Other material from that period connects some Grey lineages to the Anunnaki and describes a complicated history involving genetic engineering and hybridization.
Just think about what that would mean if true. Rather than two independent extraterrestrial civilizations fighting over territory or resources, we might be looking at different branches of the same civilization, related populations, or beings that function as parts of a much larger system. And even if conflict did exist between them, it wouldn't necessarily mean the entire species were fighting one another. Humans fight other humans all the time. Nobody concludes that every human civilization is at war because two groups have a violent disagreement.
Bashar's accounts don't verify the incident described by Grusch, nor do they establish the origins of the Greys or Reptilians. But they present an entirely different relationship between these beings, and those ideas were being discussed publicly in the 1990s, almost thirty years before the recent Rogan interview. Whether the claims reflect actual information, earlier UFO traditions, or something else is another question entirely. What interests me is that Grusch's apparent conflict could have explanations far beyond the simple idea of one alien species fighting another.
And then there's Bob Lazar, who approaches the subject quite differently.
Bob Lazar: When a Misunderstanding Turns Deadly
Bob Lazar became a central figure in modern UFO history in 1989 when he claimed to have worked at a highly classified facility called S-4, near Area 51 in Nevada. According to Lazar, he was involved in attempts to reverse-engineer extraterrestrial propulsion technology recovered from unusual spacecraft. His descriptions of gravity-based propulsion, exotic materials, and what he called Element 115 influenced decades of UFO discussion. His employment claims and the technological details of his story remain controversial, but his account remains one of the most recognizable stories in modern ufology.
Lazar has also described briefing materials that allegedly referred to small Grey beings and their origins. But when it comes to broader extraterrestrial politics, particularly stories about Reptilians, he has generally been reluctant to speculate beyond what he claims to know. During a December 1992 appearance with John Lear on Art Bell's radio program, Lazar emphasized that he preferred to restrict his statements to what he believed he had personally encountered or learned through his alleged work. This is important because Lear promoted far more elaborate claims involving extraterrestrial civilizations, secret agreements, and conspiracies. Their association doesn't mean Lazar endorsed everything Lear said.
However, Lazar did describe something remarkably similar to the kind of encounter Grusch was discussing, although the participants were quite different. In videotaped interviews from 1999, Lazar recounted an alleged incident from 1979 involving extraterrestrial beings and American security personnel at a classified facility. According to the story he had been told, humans and extraterrestrials were cooperating in some form of information exchange. The beings were conducting activities in an area where human guards were not permitted to enter, reportedly because the ammunition carried by the guards could interfere with something taking place inside. At some point, a guard allegedly entered the restricted area despite warnings, and a confrontation followed. Lazar claimed numerous guards were killed, bringing an end to the cooperative arrangement.
Now, think about that scenario for a moment. If it happened as described, we have armed American personnel killed by extraterrestrial beings at a military installation. Viewed strictly through a military lens, that certainly sounds like a hostile attack. But if the confrontation began because a guard unknowingly entered a dangerous area, perhaps the initial incident was something closer to a catastrophic misunderstanding than a declaration of war. That wouldn't excuse killing anyone, but understanding why an incident occurred is essential before deciding what it means. And since we don't know the circumstances, we can't rule out other explanations either.
Lazar didn't witness the alleged confrontation. He was repeating information he claimed to have received, and no independent evidence has established that the incident occurred. He also never identified it as a war between Greys and Reptilians. Nevertheless, the story raises an important question for our investigation: What if an encounter between humans and extraterrestrials could turn deadly without either civilization intending to start a war? We have an alleged encounter, casualties, and an intelligence assessment. What we don't have is enough information to determine what actually happened or why.
Twenty Seconds Cannot Explain an Alien Civilization
When I first heard Grusch discussing the possibility of extraterrestrial warfare, I was fascinated. How could you not be? We're talking about crashed spacecraft, living Reptilians, dead Greys, and American military personnel allegedly engaged in combat with beings from another world. That's enough material for a dozen books, yet the initial discussion about whether these species were at war lasted less than a minute. And somehow, from that brief exchange, we're already seeing headlines about alien wars. I understand why. It's an incredible story, and I certainly wouldn't have clicked past it.
But after digging into the subject, I find myself less interested in whether Grusch has revealed an extraterrestrial war and more interested in how we arrived at that conclusion. We have an alleged incident, secondhand accounts, an intelligence assessment, and a tremendous amount of missing information. We also have decades of earlier UFO material suggesting that the relationships between these alleged beings might be considerably more complicated than anything we could understand from a crashed spacecraft. None of it proves that Grusch is right or wrong. What it demonstrates is how easy it is to build an extraordinary narrative around something we don't fully understand. Perhaps the most important words in the entire Rogan discussion were Grusch's own qualification: "what we perceive as warfare." That distinction deserves far more attention than it's getting.
Before we wrap this up, there's one more question I hadn't considered when I started researching this story. We've spent a good portion of this article examining whether hypnosis, remote viewing, and channeling can offer any insight into Grusch's claims. But what happens if we turn that question around? Could Grusch's revelations eventually lend credibility to information obtained through those unconventional methods? I'm not suggesting that mentioning Greys and Reptilians decades before Grusch proves anything. These beings have been part of UFO culture for generations, and repeating similar descriptions isn't necessarily independent corroboration. But what if some of these researchers described specific relationships, events, or circumstances that later turned out to match authenticated intelligence records? At what point would we have to seriously reconsider where their information came from? It wouldn't automatically validate every hypnosis session or channeled message, but it would certainly raise some fascinating questions about how particular information was obtained.
For now, we have extraordinary claims, some intriguing overlaps, plenty of contradictions, and a great deal we simply don't know. Maybe there's an extraterrestrial war. Maybe we're misunderstanding something much more complicated. Or maybe the entire story is something else altogether. Before we start preparing to defend Earth from an alien war, perhaps we should first establish that we haven't simply watched a hunter shoot a deer.
And if Grusch eventually produces the evidence to answer that question, we might find ourselves asking an equally uncomfortable one: What else might those psychics have gotten right?
